Stealth and Dex and Ammunition Clashes

Why i believe stealth shouldn't have unlimited ammunition -

A) It completely breaks the point of dex, even if dex has better range people will still always close and attack due to different peoples posting method etc etc, as well as there ammo doing the damage of there tier unlike dex which is the tier below.

B) Unlimited ammunition - so in theory they could literally spam a shower of knives out of no where, this wouldn't make any sense.

As this doesn't have to follow realism they could throw loads in no time, which numerous times from my realism arguements ive been told realism doesn't exist....


Im thinking of more stuff atm.

-The point of Dex is long range superiority. This doesn't break that at all. A stealth user still has nowhere near the range of a dex user.

-The more people close distance on a Dex user, the harder and more impossible it becomes to dodge their shots. So trying to close in on them is risky in and of itself.

-There are countless supplementary abilities a Dex user could make to influence the movements of a closing in opponent or maintain distance.

-Sure, once an opponent DOES get in super close, you are pretty screwed. But that is because ultra close range is Dex's weakness. That doesn't change the fact that you have tons of tools which can make doing so incredibly dangerous and difficult.

-Spamming a shower of thrown knives is a terrible action if performed without an ability. You can only hold so many at a time and the more you try to throw at once, the less accurate they will be. You must also continuously grab and throw more at a limited movement speed that does not exceed that of abilities(unless perhaps you are a fanalis).

-Without using an ability, this action is time consuming, has little offensive capability even with A-tier weapons, and is basically suicide considering how open it leaves you.

-It would only take a single ability to overpower every one of your knives and hit you with an attack you couldn't react to because you were busy trying to throw 300 projectiles.



You are simply being closed minded, but you are right that it gives stealth users a pretty nice advantage to have infinite weapons. But it's really not that "strong" of an advantage considering that almost every spec also get an infinite amount of normal attacks. Strength users do. As do body manipulators and dom users. The only two classes that do not are Dex and Int.

That point alone pretty much crushes your argument when any of these other classes could just say they also spam normal attacks and counter every one of your normal attacks.

Anyways, see for yourself in the mock-battle with Garret that this is not the huge advantage you think it is considering the system mechanics as well as how RP logic works vs real life logic.

Originally when Ariella and I were discussing Stealth in the first place during the edits being made to the systems, we were considering placing a limit to the amount on the number of ammunition that you have.

Our call on that, at the time, was to not add that. As Yakuroro has said, any other class could pretty much attack as many times as they wanted to, barring Dexterty (Intelligence still has their staff they can use to hit people with D-Tier damage, lol). The other idea was that most mid-range weapons could potentially be so small as to effectively have a near infinite number of those weapons on their body.

When I spoke to Ariella then, we didn't believe that the addition of amount rules was necessary at the time. However, we also recognized that players may want to have an amount come into effect in the future. We were prepared and willing to discuss the addition of an 'ammo limit' onto Stealth Ranged ammunition, and put one in place without argument.


We spoke over skype for a bit and you're already aware of the systems and how they work, so you have a decent grasp of the clashing rules now. It should be noted that under most situations it would be difficult to really take advantage of the large amount of ammunition that you would have, however it was already predetermined that if somebody felt it needed that nerf we were willing to do that.

Ariella brought up a legitimate reason for placing a limit on their ammunition. It had to deal with the fact that a stealth player using thrown weapons could never have their weapons "broken" like with most other weapons.

I'm sure Garret is in the know about this idea and I'd like to put forward two solutions.

-The first is making an ammunition limit. Pretty straight forward. While the weapon can't be broken it can be used up.

-The second is to make each piece of ammunition have weak durability. Whenever clashing non-ability stealth ammunition against anything it can be broken or destroyed with an attack from something one tier lower than itself. So the offensive damage doesn't drop, but they are easy to "bat away" or intercept.

Honestly, I think an adaption of both of these two ideas could help nerf Stealth down to be a bit more balanced. But I would also like to state that I think Stealth ammunition should be fairly high to compensate.

Initially I didn't think unlimited ammo was a big issue considering how rarely Dex players even use their normal ammo. But if it saves us the headache of people feeling cheated or other people trying to abuse it...well, why not do something about it.

We have kept the limited ammo, however, we have removed the nerf to ranged weapons, so a B-tier bow will now deal B-tier base dame~